Tuesday, October 18, 2011

Theism, scientism, atheism …


This post is more in the nature of confirming to myself that at this particular time, when I am 57 years old, my ideas of theism, scientism, atheism were these.
This is one of the reasons I am not referring to the dictionary. The other reason is that a dictionary allows one to pick and choose from among the various meanings given therein for a word. That would allow me to be as dishonest as I wished. Alas, the Devil has me in a stranglehold and at least this once I want to be honest. And, I am not Googling while penning this post.
I want to be tied down to one meaning at this instant. If people read this post, engage me in a conversation, and if I change my idea of any or all of these –isms, then so be it. Those meanings will enter my personal dictionary till they are subsequently changed (I am an eternal optimist, that I will live long enough for that!).
Theism means a credo that accepts the validity of the concept of God. Along with the validity come the necessity and usefulness of the concept. Note that I have not said that theists, the adherents of theism, accept the existence of God. What I understand is one step removed from that definiteness. Because of this distance between the conceptual theist and God, I never discuss the existence of God with theists.
That is just as well, because I will start with a huge handicap in any such discussion. I had blogged elsewhere on a celebrated essay [1] by Antony Flew about how what starts out as a solid assertion, “God exists,” pretty much mutates into nothingness. God, as the initial assertion gets progressively diluted, suddenly becomes one with nature and how can one argue against it, even if one wished to? If God is nature, at least as per our definition of nature, God exists! This is precisely why I shy away from discussing existence of God. David Hume has more logically sound arguments about why the existence of nothing can be asserted.
Now, I want to take up scientism. My understanding is, scientism puts too high a value on empiricism, like what management courses teach, “If you cannot measure something, that something does not exist.” I reject this idea. Empiricism is valuable, no doubt. But, it is not the only thing that is valuable, and it may not even be the most valuable. That takes one into normative questions, and I would leave it at that.
The dogma associated with scientism does not leave space for speculation. And, as I believe it is only speculation (you need a speculation-based goal post for your empiricism to score a goal) that can get you to the next step while venturing into the unknown, scientism is first cousin of religion, both being born of dogmatism.
I am not saying we can assert that something that is not measurable exists. My position is a simple, “We do not know!” That is the level of my assertion. “I do not know!” is as much an assertion as, “I do know!” The problem with scientism is it constrains its own imagination, allows no leaps of faith. It freezes frames of human thought at times convenient to itself. I am not sure scientism by itself it could thaw those frames.
Scientism, in my dictionary, is a word that expresses scorn. It is not a positive philosophy that can light the path ahead. Check that. There is no path ahead. You are not allowed to speculate. So, where would you go?
So far, I have argued that both theism and scientism start off with assertions. Whereas the former descends into nothingness, the later stops at the starting point. What about atheism? It lights the way. It is never definitive about anything. No atheist worth his salt (and, if you are keen you can check out Richard Dawkins or Carl Sagan) claims with certainty that God does not exist. The door to belief is left ajar for fresh breeze to enter. Atheism allows speculation, indeed speculates. In fact, atheism was born of continued speculation of theism, but straining against the leashes; a series of “what ifs” that led to, “What if God never existed?”
It is uncertainty that atheism celebrates.

As the last point in this disquisition, I would differentiate atheism from theism first, and later from scientism. You would not find a single theist even offering to forego his belief in the concept of God, no matter the proof. I never offered, even to myself, to turn to atheism. It just happened. May be the Devil made me do it. Or, perhaps it was God!
Atheists are always ready. It is only that their demand for proof of God – concept, necessity and usefulness, not to mention existence – will be daunting. Richard Dawkins has said so. And, I say so. Read the above in the context of the recent stir in physics – neutrinos travelling faster than light. Can this brouhaha be created ever within the folds of theism? I thought not.
Scientism also will never accept that human mind has faculties that are fertile in creating valid worldviews in realms other than empiricism. Atheists will have no problem with that. They, without denying that theism may have brought some good, would rather argue that whatever good that theism/religion has brought into the world but with negatives, could have been done better (less negatives, at worst) without the concept of God.
That is why I repeatedly assert, and my assertion has not been diluted so far and has had a terrific run. 


My brand of atheism: The concept of God is sterile; useless to me.
Raghuram Ekambaram

References
1. http://www.stephenjaygould.org/ctrl/flew_falsification.html

Disclaimer: The two sentences given in bold face are in response to the comments I have received; the sentences were otherwise unmodified from the original

10 comments:

dsampath said...

Not only do i not know;but it does not matter.As Ramana said

"how does it matter whether god exists or not?.first know what can be known.Know thyself.."

mandakolathur said...

Thank you DS sir ... then, in my definition, Ramana was an atheist, because he was not looking out for an objetive reality without acknowledging the subjective reality.

Raghuram Ekambaram

New Nonentities said...

Raghuram,

Excellent article - lucid !!!

Now, let me raise my objections :)))

Aren't atheists as bad as theists when it comes to inflexibility? Both camps usually behave like Team Anna, don't they?

I prefer the "agnotists" (is that the word?) even less - they like to have the best of both worlds.

I prefer "silentists" (I have not googled and I shall ignore my dictionary). Wasn't Buddha (or was it Mahavira) a "silentist" - I mean, silent on God but vocal about everything else usually related to God?

As for the neutrinos traveling a bit too fast, I am sure both camps will devise arguments that agree with their fundamentals. :))) Well, it would be nice to have a post-Einsteinian era that would be similar to post-Newtonian theories.

By the way, "I do not know" is any day better than "I do know", right?

How I wish the theists, scientists and atheists would say "I do not know" more often.

Cheerio.

mandakolathur said...

Thanks for the apprecaition Arjun that is always accompanied with "...but ..." :))). This makes for a lively interaction.

The atheist, of the kind that I think I am and I have defined it so, knows she does not know and is not averse to admitting it. I may have had to repeat it in the post perhaps. I define an atheist as someone who works within his limites and forays into the unknown without claiming anything a priori.

It is the scientism ideologue who is shy of saying, "I do not know". Give him a sociology problem, he would treat it as a science problem but will not leave it overnight for the necessary fermentation to take place. His empiricism is under the compulsion of immediate action.

These are some of the points that for mt eh skeleton of the thoughts I had expressed.

Thanks for coming and the encouraging comment.

Raghuram Ekambaram

Tomichan Matheikal said...

Raghuram, one reason why I chose to label myself as an 'agnostic' is that I think 'atheist' is too definite, too certain, even as Salman Rushdie says in Satanic Verses. Of course, I had turned agnostic before Satanic Verses was published.

Atheism says, "There is no god." Too sure, too certain. Agnosticism says, "I don't know." More scientific?

I agree with you that scientism is just a step ahead of religion. But real science has to leave much to the test of time. Even Einstein is being questioned now - you know very well - with the neutrinos that seem to travel faster than light. The Times of India editorial about it left me wondering about the accuracy of science - a few millimetres per second!

I still stick to my agnosticism.

Tomichan Matheikal said...

One great thing about you is that you make me think again.

I come back with another comment.

Rushdie, in the same novel Satanic Verses, says that DOUBT is the real enemy of RELIGION (not science). He is right too. That way, the agnostic in me is an "enemy" of religion. The concept of enemy is charged with emotion. Perhaps, if I can overcome the problem of that emotion, I may turn an atheist.

mandakolathur said...

Matheikal, you are, if not taking a position against, ignoring the specifics of my position. I know of no atheist who has categorically said there is no God AND has offered to prove that. I have indeed put out a disclaimer that I would not argue the existence of God.

The problem with atheism is it is misunderstood as the opposite of theism. It definitely is not. Agnosticism, if taken to mean opposite of gnosticism should mean denial of intuitive knowledge. But, no,people think of agnosticism in the way it was defined by Huxley - metaphysical stuff are unknowable. I am claiming a similar meaning for atheism. God is irrelevant for atheists.

Agnosticism is a wishy-washy philosophy, occasioned by the fear of fence-sitting atheists of being clubbed with the society of dyed-in-the-wool God denying atheists. That society is a figment of imagination. Atheism knows very well that a claim that something does not exist is not provable.

E V Ramaswamy Naicker may have said God does not exist, but he stressed more that he who BELIEVES in God is a fool. For atheists, the existence of God is irrelevant. The question is, is God, even if he/she/it exists, relevant to society. The atheist, at least this one, answers in the negative.

Thanks for drawing me out.

Raghuram Ekambaram

mandakolathur said...

Matheikal,

Doubt IS science, IS atheism!

Raghuram is a better versifier thn the Satan!!!

Raghuram Ekambaram

Indian Satire said...

The concept of God has been trivalised by the self serving theists. They look upon God as an enabler for their micro and macro wishes. Very few theists pray with God in mind but only with wishes in Mind.

More disservice is done to God by his believers rather than non believers

mandakolathur said...

Thanks Balu ... that is telling truth like it is!

RE